2004 Liberty Sludge in Oil fill neck

[branny]

I have a 2004 3.7L 4x4 Liberty with 90k miles.
I tend to get a heavy build up of white sludge under my oil cap.
The car runs fine and the oil on the dipstick looks good (it was serviced recently).
The coolant system is clean and has never had a noticeable drop in level.
I recently had the PCV valve changed.

Attached is a picture I took after 100 miles at 70mph with the engine still warm. This was quite disturbing to me, so my 800 mile journey consisted of frequent stops to clean it out.

Does anybody know what may cause this problem? I can only think head gasket, but i'm convinced the coolant is staying at the same level and not getting contaminated.

Could it be the PCV tubing? I have checked the integrity, but have not removed it all to see if it's clogged.

How about some sort of crankcase leak or crack?

Thanks in advance.

 

[ltd02]

Have you removed the baffle? Does look a bit scary and heavy. There is a bit of a design flaw there and condensation does build at the front. I know when mine is warm and I pull the oil cap with it idling I can actually see vapor in the filler neck. The 4.7 even had a sludge reroute for the PCV and tubing. That said mine does this all winter and I have a 40 mile drive to work and another 40 home so it heats up real well. Mine is not very noticeable until you pull the baffle out and then it is quite obvious. Not quite as bad as yours. I did replace my HGs last spring (I had an overheat from a bad fan relay) but really hasn't helped this problem. My coolant level is stable too.

If the coolant isn't dropping then it isn't coolant. So, not likely a headgasket. When mine went I dumped a whole lot of coolant into my oil (milkshake). That would be my educated assessment.

 

[branny]

Not sure I know what you mean by baffle.
I usually drive 3 miles to and from work, so was happy it was short journey related. On the long journey I was shocked to see the sludge repeatedly.

What I don't get is, if it's not coolant then where is water coming from?

 

[van462]

Water is a byproduct of combustion. The same gases that get by your rings and into the crankcase also bring with them water vapor. Add to that condensation from the atmosphere when the engine block is cold. This is why short trips lead to more build up but even on a long trip there is water (small amounts) going into the crankcase. A compression leakdown test may show show that a cylinder isn't sealing that well. But its usually not worth fixing.

 

[ltd02]

Not sure I know what you mean by baffle.
I usually drive 3 miles to and from work, so was happy it was short journey related. On the long journey I was shocked to see the sludge repeatedly.

What I don't get is, if it's not coolant then where is water coming from?

I'll take a picture of my baffle tomorrow. There should be a plastic insert that fits in the filler tube and has a tab on top for removal. I think all years (02-07) had one. If it is missing then maybe that is making things worse. I know its been cold here in MD but the long trip shouldn't produce a buildup like that.

Van462 has a good description for the cause of the condensation and advice.

 

[LibertyTC]

That is a lot of build up !Take a look for any cracks in the in the PCV socket & in the oil filler neck. This is normally caused by condensation from shorter trips.
Does the cap seal tight?
How cold was it outside when you were doing the hwy trip?
Are you using dino or synthetic engine oil?
Remove the PCV again and see if it is gunked too, it should still rattle.

 

[nullptr]

I'll take a picture of my baffle tomorrow. There should be a plastic insert that fits in the filler tube and has a tab on top for removal. I think all years (02-07) had one. If it is missing then maybe that is making things worse. I know its been cold here in MD but the long trip shouldn't produce a buildup like that.

Van462 has a good description for the cause of the condensation and advice.

Huh. There is a baffle. Part #53032126AA, "BAFFLE, Oil Fill"

Apparently it looks like this:

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Huh. I don't think mine has one... does it just sit in there like this picture implies?

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[branny]

I have no baffle. Not sure if that would help the situation?

I think a good pcv tube and valve investigation is required, otherwise maybe it's a piston ring.

I'm using regular oil 5w30 I believe.

Thanks for all of the replies. Maybe a mechanic needs to have a look one day.

 

[ltd02]

Pretty sure you should have a baffle. You should check the PCV by removing and shaking like mentioned but if it is really cold and you don't want to risk breaking the PCV, just put your finger over the hole inside the filler neck while it's idling you should feel the vacuum. At least that tells you it isn't stuck closed.

 

[ltd02]

Huh. I don't think mine has one... does it just sit in there like this picture implies?


Yes it sort of wedges in there and covers the PCV opening. Tough to tell from the picture but the upper tilted part slants down and away from the PCV opening in mine (i.e. high side toward the PCV opening). So from your upper image of just the part, it would be positioned so that the PCV would be at the top portion of the baffle. Really don't think it will fit any other way.

Again, this is how mine is and tough to see it fit if positioned in any other way.

 

[renegade 04]

The baffle just sits in there and its purpose is to help the oil enter into the engine without burping and making a big mess. The slug is not a big deal unless it is actually in the engine. I get the slug build up in the filler neck as well and I just wipe it out with a paper towel every once in a while.

 

[ltd02]

The slug is not a big deal unless it is actually in the engine. I get the slug build up in the filler neck as well and I just wipe it out with a paper towel every once in a while.

Yep it just kind of hides things. Here's an amusing historic thread about the baffle fiasco.

Sludge!!!(oil fill baffle scam) - Dodge Dakota Forum

I found this a few years ago when I was concerned about my sludge. Now I do as above and just wipe it out periodically. Really not a problem and practically stops when the temps warm. Synthetic oil has lessened mine too.

I think it was intended to more efficiently direct vapors out the PCV but really is just a way to disguise it. Although the sludge may appear a bit worse without it.

 

[nullptr]

Huh. I don't think mine has one... does it just sit in there like this picture implies?


Yes it sort of wedges in there and covers the PCV opening. Tough to tell from the picture but the upper tilted part slants down and away from the PCV opening in mine (i.e. high side toward the PCV opening). So from your upper image of just the part, it would be positioned so that the PCV would be at the top portion of the baffle. Really don't think it will fit any other way.

Again, this is how mine is and tough to see it fit if positioned in any other way.

I guess I'll order,one, then. I had some sludge when I changed my oil after I bought it, but having previously owned a Dakota with the same, and a Cherokee with a clogged PCV, I recognized it for what it was. Did not know there was a baffle, just thought it was going to be a thing I had to deal with if I took trips where the engine didn't get warm enough to evaporate the moisture . Figured the Mobil1 oil would help, too.

The part is like $2-3, if it works, great. If not, well, it's supposed to be there anyway, so I'm sure it does something.

 

[jp7794]

The baffle was probably taken out by an oil change place (they pull them when filling with a nozzle) and never replaced.

I no longer have any sludge after switching to Mobile1.

 

[ltd02]

Here's what mine looks like today. I haven't driven it since Wednesday, but drove it M/T/W to and from work (80 miles a day). I've got Mobil 1 High Mileage in it for about 600 miles and the oil looks great.

Note how well the baffle hides the crap in the last image.

 

[profdlp]

The baffle was probably taken out by an oil change place (they pull them when filling with a nozzle) and never replaced...

I'd bet that you are right.

 

[tommudd]

:happy175: Man some of these answers
:shrug:

 

[branny]

:happy175: Man some of these answers
:shrug:

So what should I take away from this thread?

I'm thinking check pcv and try better oil. Then not worry any more.

 

[CzarKJ]

So what should I take away from this thread?

I'm thinking check pcv and try better oil. Then not worry any more.

Sounds like a good plan to me. PCV is a cheap replacement part. Be sure to have an extra in case you break the other trying to get it off.

 

[nullptr]

So what should I take away from this thread?

I'm thinking check pcv and try better oil. Then not worry any more.

Pick up a baffle, too. Like I said, it's like $2-3 online. Sure it just hides the gunk, but at least people won't freak out when you pop off the oil filler. :icon_lol: