Jen and I are looking into buying a...

[Ry' N Jen]

18-22 foot travel trailer.
As light as possible.

I know Keswick Dave owns a travel trailer and a bloke in the UK...

My question is, whats the longest/heaviest(Realistically) we could pull?
I know the Liberty has a 5000 lbs towing weight limit, but I don't want to max out the towing capacity!
I am also toying with the idea of a flat deck trailer and mounting a "Pick-up" type camper shell to it...
That way, I can use it either for camping of pulling my Mini around.

Any sugestions or ideas folks?

Cheers
Ry'

 

[ThunderbirdJunkie]

About 3,000 lb is where ThunderbirdJunkie feels the "comfortable" towing limit is with the KJ.

Sorry he can't offer any other words of wisdom

 

[Ry' N Jen]

Thats right in the ball park then!
I was thinking 3500 lbs. maximum.

 

[HoosierJeeper]

Maybe 4k if it's not going to be towed more than once a month or so. But 3-3.5k sounds right.

 

[TigerClaws]

Keep in mind, 3500 lbs .... +weight of the stuff on the trailor ...

 

[brucebotti]

I think an 18-22 foot travel trailer may be a handful regardless of the weight. The weight won't be as much of an issue as the handling will be in any type of wind. With the short wheelbase of the Liberty, any thing more than a breeze will have you changing lanes. I had some handling problems with my car trailer with a low profile sports car on it with 20-25mph winds, and I suspect it would be worse with a travel trailer. Hopefully someone with more experience will chime in.
Bruce

 

[Straight6Jeff]

along with overall weight, you have to consider frontal area. I do not remember what the max recommended frontal area is for the KJ.

I routinely tow 6k with the KJ, but that is short distances (<25 miles), and it is logs, so the load is low and balanced. With all loads, you have to know how to manipulate the trans to keep it alive. Lock out OD, feather the pedal to get TC lockup, manually shift to keep the rpms up a bit in the meat of the powerband, and anticipate stopping. Look for cross winds (watch the dust on the sides of the road).

normal weights I tow at least 4x/week are 3500lbs.

The 05 has 85k on it, no towing package. Brakes lasted 66k and trans is still going strong.
the 02 has 62k on it, no tow package. Brakes are original.


if you go with a long TT, definitely get some sway control devices.

 

[Dave]

I have a large pop-up camper that weighs 2,995 empty. If I fill the water tank and load it up with gear it weighs 3,500 + easy. It tows well and has electric brakes. I tow a boat/trailer with surge brakes that weighs more but boats tow easyier. They both stop easy with brakes.

Hooked up properly you should be fine. I had to get a longer drawbar for the boat to hook it up and clear the bottom of the spare tire and also keep the hook-up paralell to the ground. You are lifted with bigger tires so you might need a drawbar with a 2"-4" drop to get it all level depending on the height of the trailer/tongue. All trailers are different.(height wise) My utility trailer needs a 2 1/2" drop on the drawbar. If I was lifted with bigger tires, it would probably need a 4" drop.

Dave

 

[twack]

Im a bit od but ive been wanting to buy a scamp trailer for a couple years now. I dont need a huge trailer and ive always liked scamps. I like your idea of the pickup camper on a trailer, i saw someone doing that the other day and it seemed lie an aweome idea. I like the size of pickup campers but i lack the pickup.....but a trailer for my race car would be awesome to have...

 

[KeswickDave]

Hey Ry'... yes I do indeed have a 19 footer, 2700 lbs dry.

It's a 2007 Roadrunner 180 by Sun Valley. I wouldn't hesitate to recommend it, and I'm sure you can find them used, unfortunately Sun Valley went out of business last year. My only complaint about it is that I wish it had bigger windows, but we love the rear-door layout (bed is in the front).

It was marketed as a Lightweight model, and you can see where they accomplished this in a few places - the big one being it is 7.5' wide instead of the usual 8'. Also it comes with only 1, 20lb propane tank instead of 2. I compromised and swapped in a 30lb tank.

We paid around $15,000 in 2008, new but "last year's model" at the time.

I'd estimate 3500 lbs loaded, and I try not to travel with water/waste on board if possible.

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Good advice from others here, but I'll add my two cents:

I woud definitely NOT want anything bigger unless I was rockin' a CRD. Stopping has never been an issue (trailer has brakes, obviously) but on steeper uphill grades it struggles.

In about 5000 miles of towing I've had the trans temp light come on twice. I will be looking into additional cooling capacity for the transmission this summer. Coolant temperatures have never been an issue.

I can't recall the frontal area limits for the KJ either, but I know mine is within spec there.

As Brucebotti said, a trailer of this type and size IS a handful without sway control - in fact it can be down-right scary. Just pulling it home from the dealer for about 50 miles, I had some moderate crosswinds, and even passing trucks, which were really throwing things around.

Definitely invest in a weight-distribution / sway control setup. Best money I ever spent on the Jeep

I have a Reese WD/ Dual Cam Sway Control setup, and it is makes night-and-day difference. I've been through some nasty winds without incident and you barely notice passing trucks anymore. It feels like it ties the Jeep and the trailer together into one integrated unit so if there is any sideways force they move together, instead of the "tail wagging the dog" so to speak. Makes for a much more relaxing drive, I can't imagine doing a long trip without it, you'd die of stress by the end

We love it, it is our "hotel room on wheels", and also occasionally a spare bedroom at home!

Let me know if you have any questions!

Dave

 

[LibertyTC]

Ryan,
If you want to really see what it is like, try to borrow (rent) one in in a similar weight/class, before you buy one. Dual axle in that weight class and trailer brakes preferred. Make sure it has a good amount of tongue weight(150+lbs), it will drift less. (10-4 to sway control)
If it is just shorter trips, 4k in my mind is max on highway.
Really a pick-up or any longer wheel base vehicle, pulls way better (V-8) and is more stable. When I pulled the boat back from White Rock the winds were 60k sideways, so was the KJ! Now you know why I prefer the lower profile, longer wheel base sedan for pulling, don't even know It's back there. Up mountain hills the pedal is to the metal in the kj, making 4,000 rpm, sounds like 4 cylinder type noises LOL!! I don't want to sound overly critical because the kj can do it, I guess I am just spoiled having another vehicle with something real & more torque under the hood. (CRD would be a big help)
A larger ****** cooler is highly recommended! Sedan has a large aluminum one, and air shocks rear with a 2" sway bar.

 

[kb0nly]

Keep in mind, 3500 lbs .... +weight of the stuff on the trailor ...

Actually weight of the stuff in trailer, on the KJ, in the KJ, including your own weight...

The towing capacity includes anything added to the vehicle or put in it. When we had a popup camper and our minivan i liked to distribute the weight by putting all our luggage in the camper and all our food and supplies in a cooler in the van, then all i had to do was setup and bring the food and stuff into the camper onces its up and running.

Actually i wish i still had my popup, would pull easy behind the KJ, it was a 12' unit that opened up to just over 20'.

 

[KeswickDave]

Im a bit od but ive been wanting to buy a scamp trailer for a couple years now. I dont need a huge trailer and ive always liked scamps. I like your idea of the pickup camper on a trailer, i saw someone doing that the other day and it seemed lie an aweome idea. I like the size of pickup campers but i lack the pickup.....but a trailer for my race car would be awesome to have...

My first trailer was a 14' Trillium - something of a classic, it was a '74 model The fiberglass trailers really seem to have a cult following and even the older ones are highly sought after. I sold mine to a dealer in Vancouver who had it trucked across the country! I still miss that little thing

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If you are single (as I was at the time), it's great, but as you add people to it it becomes really crowded, really fast. My wife and I camped in it a few times, the worst part is the bed is the table, so you have to re-arrange everything every morning and night and there's not a lot of space to put stuff!

That was our main goal going to the larger trailer, getting one with a separate table and bed.

Granted the Scamps etc come in larger sizes so there may be one that suits you! They tend to be more expensive than the "stick built" versions of similar size though.

 

[journeyjim]

Scamps or Casita's are good small trailers, since your in Canada look at Bigfoots, they make a wide range of trailers and are well built. A Tow Low is another route to go, there is another trailer made in Canada can't think of the name now but it's like a large tear drop, that has a hydraulic lift so when parked you can stand up in it, and down when towing, I think they run around $20,000.00. Frontal area is going to affect fuel usage, side area is going to tell you how it will handle in the wind, sometimes the ultra light weight trailers are worse in the wind than a little heavier one.

 

[jnaut]

Sorry he can't offer any other words of wisdom

None? Nothing at all? Not like "don't buy bonds" or "sell Goldman short"... or "never post comments on an internet forum drunk"? Nothing?

 

[Ry' N Jen]

Thanks all,

I figure on 3000-3500 lbs. maximum loaded weight.
I've been mountaineering/backpacking for the
last 31 years so know how to pack really light!
And still pack light when just car camping with a tent...
The only real weight we carry is food, beer, and goodies!
The rest of our gear is light weight as well.
I'm just tired of tenting and cooking under a tarp in the wet
weather!
I looked at a Trillium and Bowler, just not enough head room to stand
up and not enough leg room to really stretch out.
I'm 6'5" tall.
Really want a separate "Real bed"
Would be nice to have a little luxury now.

Extra cooling would definitely be dealt with!
As well as a weight-distribution / sway control setup, electric brakes.
ALL MUST HAVE ITEMS!

Looked at a Wells Cargo trailer 8X20?
Had ramps to load a car/ATV in the back...
Windows, crapper/shower, kitchen.
Table and chairs that turn into a double bed!
Definitely customizable into something unique!
And I can stand up in it!
Sold for $13000.00 Just missed it!

That would of been a very good option.
Could hold a Mini, and could be used as a traval trailer.
It even had roof top A/C!

 

[mikey1273]

I was looking and shopping around too last fall. I have come to the conclusion that I will never try to pull anything much over 3000 pounds dry. I was told the Liberty is not supposed to pull anything over 25 foot long due to its wheel base. I did find a used Starcraft Antiqua Hybyrd expandable I sort of liked that was a few years old but then just decided I wasn't ready to make the purchase financially just yet. the expandable was real cool. it was 19 foot and has a full bath, table, kitchen and all in that space then the ends fold out like a popup for your sleeping areas. it made it feel bigger than it really was to tow when opened. It was a few years old and the dealer was asking $8595. He did say I would need a say control system to tow it or well I would just not be able to handle it with out, but with one he told me plenty of people tow lightweights with Jeeps and the sway control make it doable.

I have a CRD too so I'm not worried about how it will pull but I still want to stay safe and not over work the little thing that I kill it.

As I think about it now that I'm not with someone that has kids anymore I may just get a popup with A/C and forget about something bigger with a bath. I can use campground baths and a smaller lower unit would mean I can store it at home and not have to pay to keep it when I'm not camping.

 

[Ry' N Jen]

So, I'm thinking something like this unit.
http://vancouver.en.craigslist.ca/rds/rvs/1728527852.html
I can put something together like this for about half the money!

That way I can use the flat deck trailer for miscellaneous other
usages.

 

[Straight6Jeff]

some other tips with trailering. In the heat of summer, and heavy loads, bumping up to 89 octane will help.
Smooth easy starts are key to keeping the trans happy, as is smooth decel.
Other drivers will do everything they can to pull around, in front, on the side and maybe under you. For some reason, trailers make people think you can stop on a dime, and they WILL pull out in front of you. Nobody wants to be behind a trailer. Also, an equal number of butt-munch's do not see the trailer and will pull out smack dab into your trailer. It has happened twice to me. Both times, the Dumb-A said to the Officer ...."I did not see the trailer". The trailers it happened with had all required lighting, reflectors, etc. but they are invisible (they were 17' trailers, sot hey were not hidden".

 

[Ry' N Jen]

some other tips with trailering. In the heat of summer, and heavy loads, bumping up to 89 octane will help.
Smooth easy starts are key to keeping the trans happy, as is smooth decel.
Other drivers will do everything they can to pull around, in front, on the side and maybe under you. For some reason, trailers make people think you can stop on a dime, and they WILL pull out in front of you. Nobody wants to be behind a trailer. Also, an equal number of butt-munch's do not see the trailer and will pull out smack dab into your trailer. It has happened twice to me. Both times, the Dumb-A said to the Officer ...."I did not see the trailer". The trailers it happened with had all required lighting, reflectors, etc. but they are invisible (they were 17' trailers, sot hey were not hidden".

I hear ya there!
Back when I was 16 years of age, I pulled a 1967 Oldsmobile Delta 88
Holiday Coupe from Modesto California up to British Columbia, Canada
and had some near misses my self!
Like a E350 Ford Van pulling a tandem axle flat deck with a 22+ foot
long vehicle is hard to miss!

Make one wonder how some people actually passed their drivers exam!