Overheating when Idling -- question on fan part

[musmin2415]

So, from my research, it sounds like this has been talked about quite a bit. I've noticed over the past year that my jeep's temperature really started to creep up when I would be at a stop light or sitting in a drive thru. But once I would take off on a main road and get up to 30-40mph, it would cool off VERY quick -- within 30 seconds usually. I don't notice any leaks of any kind, and there's plenty of coolant. I also tried testing it by letting it heat up in my driveway, and then turn off ignition. I noticed the fan would keep spinning for a bit.

I don't know a lot about fixing cars, but I've done minor repairs on my wife's envoy -- replacing electric window motors, a/c actuators, water pumps, tune-ups, fan clutch, etc. So I have a couple of (dumb) questions when it comes to my 2011 Jeep Liberty Limited 4x4:
- Am I on the right track for replacing the fan first?
- I'm guessing it doesn't have a fan clutch that connects to the water pump?? Just a cooling fan assembly?
- Can I just go with a fan kit from my local Autozone, etc?

I have another question, but it has to do with my engine light and an emissions leak. I'll have to save that for another post because I really just want to see what the most common causes are.

Thanks!!

EDIT: Btw, this is the fan that I'm looking at from Amazon --
TYC 621940 Jeep Liberty Replacement Radiator/Condenser Cooling Fan Assembly

 

[John P.]

Hi, I too have a 2011 Liberty limited. I had to fix my fan due to a broken belt tearing up the wiring harness connection. It does have a mechanical fan with a clutch attached. If you hear the electric fan running and moving air when at idle then you probably need the mechanical fan clutch. My Liberty stayed cool temp wise without the electric fan in 90+ heat, the issue for me was the air conditioning wouldn't work properly without the electric fan. Probably wouldn't hurt to do a coolant flush and fill with proper HOAT coolant. Reading the forums seems to imply these 3.7 engines don't like other types of coolant. I've got 110k now on mine, no other issues except the things you expect to fail in Chrysler products, like window switches.

 

[musmin2415]

Hi, I too have a 2011 Liberty limited. I had to fix my fan due to a broken belt tearing up the wiring harness connection. It does have a mechanical fan with a clutch attached. If you hear the electric fan running and moving air when at idle then you probably need the mechanical fan clutch. My Liberty stayed cool temp wise without the electric fan in 90+ heat, the issue for me was the air conditioning wouldn't work properly without the electric fan. Probably wouldn't hurt to do a coolant flush and fill with proper HOAT coolant. Reading the forums seems to imply these 3.7 engines don't like other types of coolant. I've got 110k now on mine, no other issues except the things you expect to fail in Chrysler products, like window switches.

Thanks so much for the reply! So, is the fan clutch inside the radiator fan assembly (under the coolant and windshield washer fluid reservoirs)? Because like I said, it's not like my envoy where the fan clutch is attached to the water pump. Second, can the wrong type of coolant cause the issues that I'm having? Again, I don't know much, so I'm not saying you're wrong. It just seems off that the wrong type of coolant would cause my temp to go up only when I'm at a stoplight or in a drive thru. Having said that, it's not like I'm out anything just by trying different coolant. (Btw, coolant recommendation?)

 

[John P.]

The mechanical fan clutch is attached to the water pump on the front of the engine behind the electric fan. It's a tight squeeze getting the electric fan out past the mechanical one. Zerex G-05 Hoat. As long as it's a Hoat. The mixing of improper coolants can cause issues. I experienced this myself when I let a shop that is supposedly ASE certified flush and fill my coolant. They put the wrong type in plus did a poor flush and a week later I had no heat. Had to take it back, they did everything again and I provided the proper coolant. They insisted they didn't cause a problem and that coolant type doesn't matter but the results tell the true story.

 

[LibertyTC]

Musmin2415 would it be safe to say that you only have the electrical cooling fan ?
The viscous fan/clutch set up (belt driven) would greatly help if you don't have one, get one. Check the Mopar pricing, it will last a very long time.
If you have the A/C on, the electrical fan should be always on & cooling.

Using anything other than Mopar Hoat or Zerex-G-05 is bad news.
They don't mix well together at all and will cause coagulation and poor flow characteristics.
If you believe that you have different coolants in your system, it is time for a flush big time!
The dealer for a reasonable price also has the proper flush machine service, and will remove all the bad & install the correct Hoat.

 

[John P.]

Thanks, LibertyTC, I was wondering when you we're chiming in I thought all the 2008+ came equiped with the mechanical fan.

 

[musmin2415]

Musmin2415 would it be safe to say that you only have the electrical cooling fan ?
The viscous fan/clutch set up (belt driven) would greatly help if you don't have one, get one. Check the Mopar pricing, it will last a very long time.
If you have the A/C on, the electrical fan should be always on & cooling.

Using or mixing anything other than Mopar Hoat or Zerex-G-05 is bad news.
They don't mix well together at all and will cause coagulation and poor flow characteristics.
If you believe that you have different coolants in your system, it is time for a flush big time!
The dealer for a reasonable price also has the proper flush machine service, and will remove all the bad & install the correct Hoat.

Ha! I think it's safe to say that! I only laugh because I thought I was going blind. Is there a way to tell if the electrical fan is going bad? Also, I heard that a belt-driven fan can be helpful, but also incredibly noisy. Any truth to that?

And crap, yeah, when you put it that way, there might just be different coolants in my system - and by that, I mean more than likely. And since it sounds like that's a huge deal (which I honestly had no idea), maybe that's the whole issue. I'm just really short on cash, so I wish there was an effective way I could do the flush myself.

 

[John P.]

When my belt driven fan comes on it is barely noticeable with the windows up. Windows down, you will hear it. The coolant flush diy isn't super difficult, lots of good YouTube videos on it. Hardest part is getting all the air out. I was just being lazy and let a shop do it because I only get one day off a week. Learned my lesson. If you want something done to personal satisfaction it is best to do it yourself. I have been doing things so long on my own I didn't realize just how difficult it has become to find a good shop nowadays. As far as testing the fan, not sure there, I put power from the battery to the broken harness of the fan to make sure it still worked and it did. Once assembled and hooked up it functioned as it should as far I know. I hear it come on and cycle with the A/C.

 

[musmin2415]

When my belt driven fan comes on it is barely noticeable with the windows up. Windows down, you will hear it. The coolant flush diy isn't super difficult, lots of good YouTube videos on it. Hardest part is getting all the air out. I was just being lazy and let a shop do it because I only get one day off a week. Learned my lesson. If you want something done to personal satisfaction it is best to do it yourself. I have been doing things so long on my own I didn't realize just how difficult it has become to find a good shop nowadays. As far as testing the fan, not sure there, I put power from the battery to the broken harness of the fan to make sure it still worked and it did. Once assembled and hooked up it functioned as it should as far I know. I hear it come on and cycle with the A/C.

Thanks, John P.!

 

[lfhoward]

To the original poster:
- The 08 KK has a mechanical fan with a fan clutch if it came with the factory tow package. If you don’t have one, you can add it (I did). It makes a big difference keeping the Jeep’s engine and transmission cool. (The transmission cooler is part of the radiator assembly.)
- All KK’s have the electric fan to cool the radiator. To see if yours is bad, turn your Jeep on and run the air conditioning. The e-fan should be on continuously with the AC running. If it doesn’t run, you can disconnect the pigtail and test it directly with 12 volt power. If it doesn’t run on 12 volt, the fan is bad. If it does, there is probably a wiring fault somewhere upstream.

 

[LibertyTC]

The electrical cooling fan ya..lets talk about that. First off unless you are driving with your hood off, these jeeps get real hot especially in warmer climates.
Do I have the temperatures specs etc for the KK to kick into high speed ..No unfortunately.
If you have a correctly functioning temp gauge it may go slightly above the middle stuck idling in traffic for instance/ normal.
Plugging into the OBDII port with a scangauge will report actual temperatures and I know the KJ's high speed fan does not engage until around 227F.
Now about the viscous fan, fact the electrical fan will have to work harder without a mechanical fan especially in summer. (you want one!) Your A/C should also preform better then too.

Flush at home: Well it can be done, but not very environmentally friendly.
Using tap water to flush no matter what, will leave hard water inside the block, unless you drain the block too.
The dealer using De-mineralized water mix with hoat is what I recommend for the best protection overall.

 

[Mator1988]

Ha! I think it's safe to say that! I only laugh because I thought I was going blind. Is there a way to tell if the electrical fan is going bad? Also, I heard that a belt-driven fan can be helpful, but also incredibly noisy. Any truth to that?

And crap, yeah, when you put it that way, there might just be different coolants in my system - and by that, I mean more than likely. And since it sounds like that's a huge deal (which I honestly had no idea), maybe that's the whole issue. I'm just really short on cash, so I wish there was an effective way I could do the flush myself.

Unplug connection run wire from ground and hot touch prongs. if fan don't come on it's bad. I just straight wired mine today

 

[musmin2415]

Hey everyone. So, I wanted to give a quick update just in case this helps anyone in the future. Also, in answer to the other question -- in my ignorance, I just assumed that since the jeep seemed to have all the other "bells & whistles", as well as the tow hitch, that it had the tow package. It does not, therefore, all I have is the electrical radiator fan.

So, what I decided to do is give it a full flush. I'm not a "car guy" (although I wish I was), but I called around to my usual auto mechanic, and then the jeep dealership, and they gave me quotes of $140 and $170. Side note: I thought it was strange that my auto mechanic never heard that a Jeep needed HOAT coolant, and that that might be a possible cause of it heating up.

With my limited funds (wife not working at the moment), I decided to do the flush myself and read up back-flushing the heater core and engine block. I bought the zerex G05, as well as some cleaner to run through the system. Most of my help came from different threads in this forum, so it was just a matter of piecing everything together. First, I drained the radiator -- I couldn't get the drain **** to work, and I read about others cross-threading it and never getting it to seal again once they removed it, so I just removed the lower radiator hose. Not too hard to get to, but incredibly messy. After that, I noticed I still had a bunch of coolant in the reservoir. I tried to remove that, but it was nearly impossible to get to the two hex screws on the bottom. (Any hints on that for the next time, please share.) So, I just removed the hose connecting the radiator and the reservoir and pointed it down to the pan under the jeep. From there I rinsed the reservoir with the hose and it continued to drain into the pan underneath.

From there I connected all the hoses again, put in the bottle of cleaner (can't remember the name), and filled the rest up with distilled water. I followed the directions and ran the jeep for 20 minutes with the heater on high. I also drove around a bit to hopefully get a 'deeper clean'. Came home, let it cool, emptied the system once again. I poured distilled water through the radiator until it ran clear.

Then I disconnected the two heater core hoses and ran water from the hose through one side at a time until it ran clear. (It seemed fairly clean to begin with -- no gunk or sludge.) I then re-connected those hoses.

I tried to disconnect the upper radiator hose in order to back flush the engine block, but one, I wasn't sure I was even doing that right, and two, I couldn't get the hose disconnected without being able to remove whole reservoir that was above the radiator. Anyway, long-story-short, it was almost midnight, and I was just praying I got everything clean enough.

From there I made sure all the hoses were re-connected and filled the system back up with 50/50 distilled water and zerex G05. I 'burped' the system for a bit, and then took it out for a drive. It heated up once, and then settled down. Crazy thing that I noticed, though, is that now the heater wasn't throwing any heat whatsoever! However, I felt that that could be a battle for another day.

This morning I got up, refilled the system (there were no leaks, so I assume it just cycled into the system a bit more), 'burped' it some more, and then went for a drive. I was going to put it through the real test -- it was fairly warm out, I was going to be running the a/c, and I was going to be waiting outside of a store for my wife, as well as waiting in a drive-thru.....AND, the temperature gauge actually stayed LOWER than it usually did! (Just below mid-way.) I couldn't believe that it worked! I came home, and topped off the radiator AGAIN, but still no leaks. I also read up on no heating problem, and it said that sometimes after a flush you won't have heat until all the air is out of the system. It seemed like I've let the system burp FOR SO LONG and there were STILL bubbles every once in awhile. I then took it out tonight, and I THINK my heating got better, but I'm not 100% certain.

Anyway, I'm happy that I saved some money -- over $100. And I especially want to thank forums like this that have so much helpful information. I love my jeep, and I hope it lasts me a LONG TIME. THANKS EVERYONE!

(If anyone has any advice or notes on this, I'd love to hear 'em!)

 

[LibertyTC]

Did you buy the concentrated (full strength) zerex G-05 or The jugs that said pre-mixed?
Check each morning cold & re-fill as necessary to the cold line.
If your heat is still not up to speed and want to release a bit of air...
Once jeep is hot just crack open the hex bleed screw, a few bubbles and coolant will come out, close bleed screw.

You must be registered for see images attach

 

[musmin2415]

Did you buy the concentrated (full strength) zerex G-05 or The jugs that said pre-mixed?
Check each morning cold & re-fill as necessary to the cold line.
If your heat is still not up to speed and want to release a bit of air...
Once jeep is hot just crack open the hex bleed screw, a few bubbles and coolant will come out, close bleed screw.

You must be registered for see images attach

I always buy the full strength since it’s better value. And thanks for the advice!! Also, where’s the hex bleed screw?

 

[LibertyTC]

Just behind where the top rad hose connects, I guess I should redo that photo to make it clearer.

 

[uss2defiant]

-i think the e-rad fan at autozone has lifetime warranty. not sure about the KK but the KJ yes.
-i would get the coolant system pressure kit from the loaner tool program. for the KJ you'll need both toolkits not sure about the KK. Might as well get both just in case.
AutoZone cooling system test kit - 940427T & 647893T
-on the KK, that hex bleeder screw would be right behind the windshield fluid reservoir.

 

[LibertyTC]

Geez Thanks uss2defiant, I'm working too many threads and dropping between KK & kj's ...

 

[uss2defiant]

No worries.
It's pretty much the same engine I think.
They just moved the rad and windshield reservoir up in the front.