02 Liberty wont start

[Ian Skolnick]

I have an 02 Liberty Sport, automatic, part time T/C.

A month or so ago I got in the liberty in the morning and the idle was around 2000 for about 10 minutes. It finally slowed and it drive find the rest of the day.

I brought the Jeep to my mechanic because of a lack of heat. I picked up the liberty the next morning and the Jeep seemed to be in limp mode, no acceleration until about 15kmh then it accelerated fine. I was driving home when about 20 minutes into the drive, it just died and hasn't started since.

I checked the compression, fuel pressure is good. The computer was replaced with a used one and reprogrammed at Chrysler. The ADS fuse has power when the key is in the start position.

There is spark and there is fuel.

Any ideas where to check next?

Tjank you,
Ian

 

[Duster]

OK so, explain so I have this straight.

Apparently the engine is actually turning over but not running?

Compression is fine, spark is fine, and I guess you also smell fuel to know there is fuel actually being injected?

If so the next logical thing to check for is air. Inspect everything to make sure you don't have an intake leak, or an intake restriction. I also say this because of your high idle situation. That is sometimes an intake air leak somewhere.

Also when you say you took it in for no heat. What was the cause of no heat? What was done to repair? I hope it wasn't a heater core related thing and coolant system was left with a bunch of air in it.....

 

[Ian Skolnick]

OK so, explain so I have this straight.

Apparently the engine is actually turning over but not running?

Compression is fine, spark is fine, and I guess you also smell fuel to know there is fuel actually being injected?

If so the next logical thing to check for is air. Inspect everything to make sure you don't have an intake leak, or an intake restriction. I also say this because of your high idle situation. That is sometimes an intake air leak somewhere.

Also when you say you took it in for no heat. What was the cause of no heat? What was done to repair? I hope it wasn't a heater core related thing and coolant system was left with a bunch of air in it.....

The dealer who reprogrammed the computer did a fuel pressure test, and I smell fuel when I try to start it, so I know that is OK. The engine turns over and at times it sounds like it might catch, but it never does. My mechanic said the heater core was plugged. After running a hose through it, he swapped the two hoses coming from the water pump around. heater core inlet to outlet and heater core outlet to inlet. It worked because there is heat in the car now. I tried starting it with the intake hose disconnected from the throttle body.

 

[LibertyTC]

Leave intake hose connected.
What was the fuel pressure (psi) readings with key on ? Key off for 10 minutes what is the reading?
Was it scanned for codes? If so, are there any stored Problem codes?
The IAC controls the idle & the plunger may be sticking, easier to remove the IAC, install a new one, & make sure the port & throttle body is cleaned of carbon.
New correct spark plugs? Remove them for inspection.
What was the compression test readings? No more than 10% between cylinders are acceptable.
I'd like to see the color & burn conditions & current gaps sizing please.

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It is also possible that your Jeep may now be upset that you called it a car. They do have feelings too ya know.

 

[Duster]

Well... you have compression, spark, and fuel. Need timing and related sensors. ***** when it won't start so you can't get anywhere to check for codes to help narrow it down.

I do wonder why your heater core plugged. I am guessing he found gunk? If not it could have been air. And if it was gunk, where did all that go?

I would honestly look in the radiator. And I would try to open the bleeder on the upper hose neck. Check the oil and look for any signs of coolant. Etc.

I say this because once upon a time I saw one of these with heat, but air in the system get drove up the street and back, half mile round trip. It didn't make it back. Just died and would not crank back. We coasted in in the driveway. Same thing. I got under the hood and heard some gurgling. I figured it was toasted. In a bit I got some rags and gloves and started attempting to open the cap. Next day I went back and filled it the rest of the way up. It fired right up like nothing was ever wrong. I don't know why. If there was a protective shutoff that would be nice. But I don't think there is. So I can't say I think this is an issue. But heck don't hurt to open your radiator cap right?

In the end I think you are going to have to get a scan tool on it. I hope a friend has one and can drop by and do a read for you or something. May find all of this is unrelated and a sensor is just bad.

 

[Billwill]

After the Dealer re-programmed the PCM did the Jeep start and run at all?

After clearing the heater core was the coolant replaced with clean water and the correct Red HOAT or Zenex anti-freeze?

Does the engine turn over but not fire?

The newer Jeeps have a Red LED on the left of the Cluster that either lights up solid or flashes when there is a problem with the Skees ant-theft system.

Older JKs like yours do not have this Red Led but has an Amber colored "Key" symbol which likewise lights up or flashes when there is a Skees problem with the chipped key.

Check that this Amber Key symbol lamp is working and has not burnt out or been disabled by doing the following:

Press in the Odometer Reset button while switching ignition "ON" but do not try start the Jeep. The Cluster will operate all the gauges back and forth and illuminate all the lamps on the Cluster.

Make sure the "Key" symbol lamp does light up!

 

[Ian Skolnick]

The jeep turns over but does not start. It hasn't started since the first time it died. I do not know the compression numbers or the fuel pressure numbers but the dealership said it was all OK. I checked the anti-theft symbol on the dash and it lights up when I put the key to the on position, but it does not come on when I try to start the Jeep.

 

[Ian Skolnick]

Well... you have compression, spark, and fuel. Need timing and related sensors. ***** when it won't start so you can't get anywhere to check for codes to help narrow it down.

I do wonder why your heater core plugged. I am guessing he found gunk? If not it could have been air. And if it was gunk, where did all that go?

I would honestly look in the radiator. And I would try to open the bleeder on the upper hose neck. Check the oil and look for any signs of coolant. Etc.

I say this because once upon a time I saw one of these with heat, but air in the system get drove up the street and back, half mile round trip. It didn't make it back. Just died and would not crank back. We coasted in in the driveway. Same thing. I got under the hood and heard some gurgling. I figured it was toasted. In a bit I got some rags and gloves and started attempting to open the cap. Next day I went back and filled it the rest of the way up. It fired right up like nothing was ever wrong. I don't know why. If there was a protective shutoff that would be nice. But I don't think there is. So I can't say I think this is an issue. But heck don't hurt to open your radiator cap right?

In the end I think you are going to have to get a scan tool on it. I hope a friend has one and can drop by and do a read for you or something. May find all of this is unrelated and a sensor is just bad.

My mechanic has a few different scan tools and he used one. He had it connected and had all the readings for the sensors. When he turned the key to the start position, all the info for the sensors went to N/A.
Everything he was looking at. This is why he thought it was the computer.

There is obviously an electrical issue that is interfering with the computer.

 

[Duster]

So if it is at the dealer now, take them your old computer to install and scan.

I just went through all of the SCREEM stuff on my 2007 so if you had a 2007 I could really hook you up with knowledge there. I will look and see if I can find and absorb the info from 2002 and see if I can help. Hopefully someone will have already been through it with one with the amber key light and chime in with the info.

All I can tell you at the moment is that on my 2007 it had the red led dot. I had no clue what it was. I thought it was a fuel pump prime light lol. Anyways when my stuff screwed up, initially mine would start and run 2 seconds then die. When it didn't start the second time I just grabbed keys for the other car cause I was in a hurry. Later when I got back to it and tried again I ended up trying too many times and it immobilized. It did nothing when I turned the key.

I don't know how the 2002 system differs. Hopefully someone can confirm or I will return and say.

Me, I would take the original computer to be installed and scanned for codes. Try to find out what it knew or thought it knew. Then I would make a decision on rather or not I thought that the used computer that was reprogrammed to the jeep was just no good or if I had something going on that damages computers. Usually the failure rate is lower than the damaged rate... except on computers pulled from vehicles that have been out of commission a long time.

In my case I still dont know if my computer went bad or my security key stuff went bad because I ordered a computer with the security key stuff deleted and I haven't had a chance to drive it somewhere, put the old computer in and have it scanned to see if I can get an idea.

 

[Duster]

That was quicker than I thought. Watch what the light does and compare.

SENTRY KEY IMMOBILIZER SYSTEM DIAGNOSIS

INDICATOR FLASHES WHEN KEY IS TURNED TO ON POSITION

Issue
1- thinks the key is invalid
2- key related fault

INDICATOR LIGHT LIGHTS SOLID FOLLOWING THE BULB TEST

Issue
1- system malfunction fault detected
2- system inoperative

Unfortunately though, the manual is not explicit about the run behavior from these issues. It only says that the engine will be immobilized after running for 2 seconds. So that doesn't help a lot except you would have to look at the light and think back as to rather or not it ever fired and ran 2 seconds.

Ugg... hopefully this will help you rule in or rule out the security key stuff.

With that said, it is important to get things chronologically correct here too. I am assuming it went in for the no heat first. Then heat worked but it ran bad. Then died and would not start back. Now it has a reprogrammed computer installed that is "supposed to be" "correctly programmed" by the dealer and it still won't start and run. Is that correct?

If it were me, I would check with both computers and see if there are any stored codes or if any live data can be seen when trying to crank it over. If not then I think maybe unhook things and start testing for continuity on the PCI data bus wire connections... from the computer to each place it runs to... to see if it is broken somewhere. Could be that the computers are bad. Could be that they aren't getting any data to report because none is making it back to the computer.

If you find there is no continuity beep between the harness terminal for the computer for the data bus and the sensors then that might be the case. So then you start testing between the body control module and the same spot. Then between the body control module and each sensor it runs to in order to try to figure out where the connection is broken.

Hope it is not any of this and something real simple.

 

[Billwill]

Very good chance that the Crank Sensor or the Cam Sensor is faulty....usually does not post a code.
Replace them with Mopar parts.

Check if the ASD Relay is energizing...you can carefully pry the plastic cover off the Relay and watch to see if the contacts do move when you turn ignition ON.
You should in any case swap over the ASD Relay with an identical one nearby!

You can pull codes out by yourself using the "key" method...works up to 2005 models.

Without moving the ignition key to Start, rapidly turn the ignition ON/OFF 3 times.
After the 3rd ON action leave the Ignition ON.

The Odometer Display will display the codes in sequence..oldest codes first and newest codes last...write them all down.

Only concern yourself with the last few codes..the first codes displayed could be ancient history.

The Export Models such as I have require 4 ON/OFF actions to display codes.

Download the 2002 Jeep KJ Service Manual here then look up the last codes and follow the diagnostic instructions given...except when they call for a DBIII Tool which only the Dealers have!

www.colorado4wheel.com/manuals/Jeep/KJ/

 

[Ian Skolnick]

I ordered a new crank and camshaft sensor. I'll put them in next week and I'll see if it starts.

 

[bowyjay]

I had to try starter fluid after changing the coolant temp sensor and intake air sensor, new spark plugs and cleaned the throttle body. It worked. 2 person job. But it worked! No idea why it stopped starting after replacing the CTS.

 

[J33Pfan]

This an old post, but just because the fuel pressure was good at the shop doesnt mean it's good when it dont start. Engine off - Press the schrader valve to see if any pressure is visible. Don't start a fire.