Oil change without pulling drain plug?

[Rant72]

Hello all,

Been lurking here for a couple weeks since I bought an 03 liberty renegade. I could use some help though so I just made an account.

As the title says, does anyone know of a way I can change most of the oil without pulling the drain plug? It may sound dumb, but I just crawled underneath to do a quick oil change (dealer claimed he just did it, which now I believe was bs) and the drain plug is gobbed with blue rtv. I threw a wrench on it and it's pretty well stuck. When I apply a decent amount of torque on it the pan is flexing pretty good. The pan is rusty/flaky and it feels like by the time I bust the drain plug loose, I could very easily pop a hole in the pan/put a crease in it somewhere. After researching how to change the oil pan, I would really like to avoid doing that at all costs (it's my dd atm).

I know it will probably break loose fine and I'm just being overly couscous, but at this point in time I don't have near enough time to drop the front end off of this thing to change the pan if the unthinkable did happen.

Does anyone have any suggestions, or is the concensus I should man up and wack it with a hammer?

On a side note, I've had a decent amount of time pulling on a wrench and my gut tells me not to break it loose.

 

[mx3_ryder]

Well let me first say welcome to the forum. Getting the oil drained is just not possible without removing drain plug. I would try to get the plug out somehow maybe by chipping away some of that rtv around the plug and then tapping on the wrench or rachet with hammer in quick motion to break it free. If that doesn't do the trick maybe an impact would work better with short bursts of torque to start keeping close eye not to twist the plug out of the pan if that tender. Good luck

 

[LibertyTC]

Welcome as well...
I hear blue RTV and wonder what else is going on...
Does your oil pan plug look like this?
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You must be registered for see images attach

I hope that it is the stock plug with the nice sealing washer, not something else in there...

 

[Birdman330]

Blue RTV on the plug, never a good thing.

Well let me first say welcome to the forum. Getting the oil drained is just not possible without removing drain plug. I would try to get the plug out somehow maybe by chipping away some of that rtv around the plug and then tapping on the wrench or rachet with hammer in quick motion to break it free. If that doesn't do the trick maybe an impact would work better with short bursts of torque to start keeping close eye not to twist the plug out of the pan if that tender. Good luck

^ those are good, not to mention a few quick blows to the plug itself with a brass mallet might help too so not to do any damage to the plug and see if you can crack the RTV that way.

 

[teeje]

Well, best option you have is buy a new pan with the plug since you said the pan is rusted. 3800$ engine or a small part.
I just had a new engine installed and I'd hate to hear you having to do the same because you start losing oil.


2002 Jeep Liberty 3.7L with brand new engine
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[tommudd]

I know that everyone knows this already
BUT for those who don't............
some dealers put a gob of blue crap on the plug when they do oil changes
The 03 had it when I was going over it, asked them the next day about it before I bought it. They had just changed the oil> Told me what they did and IF I had any issues with the plug or pan they would replace it Changed it twice in the last 5000 miles and no leaks, plug is good and so is the pan

No worries Mon.........

 

[LibertyTC]

^That's interesting, I can see that, even tho no dealers here have done that on mine.
I know some like to use a marker, across plug to pan, to ensure it has not moved.

 

[mx3_ryder]

Not sure if its possible to change the pan without removing engine but there is a video on you tube showing how to replace it with engine in. Might check it out. Just google changing oil pan on jeep liberty.

 

[jja]

You can pump oil out of the dipstick pipe. You need a long enough hose and some kind of pump (even a big syringe will do but it will take a looong time to get 5 quarts out that way). Of course some gunk will possibly remain at the bottom of the pan that way but you'll get the oil out and put new fresh one in.

Maybe you could pump oil out of the oil filter hole once you unscrew it but I am not really sure that will work out.

 

[M38 Bob]

Nearly every 4 stroke engine modified for marine use has to have the oil changed by siphoning it out at the dip stick tube. There's not enough room between the bottom of pan and drain to put a drain bucket and even if there was, there's no way to get the drain bucket out without spilling oil all over interior of hull. Many also use remote mount filters for the same reason.

I'd be hell bent on removing the drain plug, but siphoning is a viable option.

Bob

 

[s2kdriver]

Worked at a oil change place through college and we had to use blue "torque seal" to prevent tampering and it looked exactly like rtv so that is definitely a possibility.

 

[Hockeygoon]

Don't one of the major quick oil change chains only siphon the oil because their people were cross threading to many oil plugs?

 

[HoosierJeeper]

What if you just took it to a shop for an oil change and see if they flinch at it?

 

[Birdman330]

Take it to a tires plus, have them do it and if they break it blame them, make a scene and get it done for free.

 

[tommudd]

If I was the OP I wouldn't hesitant for a second to remove the drain plug and proceed on.

 

[M38 Bob]

If I was the OP I wouldn't hesitant for a second to remove the drain plug and proceed on.

Nor would I.

Bob

 

[CodeWarrior]

You can remove the oil pan without removing the engine, but you are going to have to get some good clearance off the ground and it is likely to get messy. The bolts around the edge are 10mm I believe, and will come out with a bit of elbow grease. The bigger problem is the seal/gasket.
The easiest way that I have seen to do it is:
1. Put a block of some kind under the pan, leave a couple of inches of clearance.
2. Get a putty knife, insert it into the gob of black rubbery sealant on the oil pan side.
3. Slide the putty knife along the gasket, separating the pan.
4. As gently as you can, pry and lower the pan onto the object you blocked under it. This is the messy part. The pan is likely to be full of oil, and is likely to spill out all over the place here.

You will likely want to replace the oil pan gasket. It includes a thin metal plate that keeps the crankshaft separated from the oil in the pan. There are two bolts that attach the oil pickup tube to the gasket plate, and a third bolt that attaches the pickup tube to the engine block. Remove these and the oil pickup tube can be removed, then the gasket. Replace gasket, add sealant (don't recall what kind right off hand), replace oil pickup tube, finally put new oil pan on and ensure than oil drain plug is snug.

I won't lie to you, there is a big risk that you are going to get oil everywhere doing this. You can try finding a hand pump, shoving the tube down the dipstick tube and pumping most of the oil out before starting.

The oil pan gasket is pretty cheap. Here is one at RockAuto. New oil pan is not terribly expensive either. $50-60.

 

[M38 Bob]

Hell, I'd drill a hole in a pan before I'd attempt to remove it FULL!!!!

Bob

 

[Rant72]

Thank you for all of your replies. I did not get a chance to mess with it last night, but I think I'm going to try to get that drain plug out tonight. I'm going to pick away as much rtv as I can, warm it up some, and put my cordless impact on it. Worse comes to worse I will seal it back up with jb weld and ride the bike to work tomorrow.

From what I see of the drain plug, it does appear to be stock, though it's in pretty rough condition. If it does come out for me, a new one will be going in.

This is the first I've heard of marine oil changes. I will have to do some looking around to see if I have a pump around that would suck it up out (a syringe would be brutal haha). If I start warping the pan I will have to try to do it this way. It would at least get me by long enough for warmer weather to pull the pan.

As far as changing the pan, I would really prefer to do that but everything Ive read involves lifting the motor some, and/or dropping the front end a bit. I did see one person cut the cross member out and welded it back in (I tried finding it again but I came up short). Honestly I would probably either cut the cross member out or just replace pull the motor and put one a little younger in it (this one has 180k on it).

A third thought is I do have a 4500mi aftermarket power train warranty the dealer put on it. I will have to do some research on that to see; if I did mess the pan up and caused a leak, if they would pay to have a shop replace it. Sounds a lot better to me to let them do it then spend time laying on a concrete floor myself.

I want to thank everyone again for their suggestions. I will post back how I make out with it.

 

[tommudd]

Thank you for all of your replies. I did not get a chance to mess with it last night, but I think I'm going to try to get that drain plug out tonight. I'm going to pick away as much rtv as I can, warm it up some, and put my cordless impact on it. Worse comes to worse I will seal it back up with jb weld and ride the bike to work tomorrow.

From what I see of the drain plug, it does appear to be stock, though it's in pretty rough condition. If it does come out for me, a new one will be going in.

This is the first I've heard of marine oil changes. I will have to do some looking around to see if I have a pump around that would suck it up out (a syringe would be brutal haha). If I start warping the pan I will have to try to do it this way. It would at least get me by long enough for warmer weather to pull the pan.

As far as changing the pan, I would really prefer to do that but everything Ive read involves lifting the motor some, and/or dropping the front end a bit. I did see one person cut the cross member out and welded it back in (I tried finding it again but I came up short). Honestly I would probably either cut the cross member out or just replace pull the motor and put one a little younger in it (this one has 180k on it).

A third thought is I do have a 4500mi aftermarket power train warranty the dealer put on it. I will have to do some research on that to see; if I did mess the pan up and caused a leak, if they would pay to have a shop replace it. Sounds a lot better to me to let them do it then spend time laying on a concrete floor myself.

I want to thank everyone again for their suggestions. I will post back how I make out with it.

Wouldn't use an impact on it, no need to, just use God given muscles, more chance of screwing it up with an impact gun.
As far as cutting the cross member, " almost the" dumbest thing I ever heard , why in the world would you cut out a structural piece ?