Unleaded 88 safe?

[02blue]

Another interesting read.

https://extension.psu.edu/fuel-ethanol-hero-or-villain

BTW Ethanol actually increases octane. It's a tricky issue as indicated in the above article. I have a 4.0 L Ford OHV engine in an old Ranger and it'll hate me for using premium (higher octane) gasoline since it doesn't burn completely in lower compression engines due to its lower volatility and some other design issues with the 4.0L. The result is lower MPGs and enhanced carbon deposits with lots of detonation (pinging) when going back to using the recommended 87 octane gas.

 

[lfhoward]

An interesting, well explained video about EtOH in fuel:

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[Johnny O]

Thanks for taking the time to expand on this.

As I've said before, here in the UK, we only got E10 wished on us earlier in the year (I think about the same time as most of Europe, although, as travel has been severely curtailed over the last couple of years, I can't be sure) but the higher octane option (only available from the "majors") stayed at 5% - &, as already admitted, I only ever look at price of gas on my travels around/across America (not to be resumed any time soon, sadly, thanks to the DHS changing the rules). Perhaps if I had, I might've better understood the advice to chose by octane rating, making no mention of the ethanol content.

Here, of course, the basic "Use 87 around town and 89 when loaded, towing, or on long freeway trips…" rule doesn't work, because the lower octane fuel has more ethanol, whereas the higher octane, while significantly more expensive, returns better consumption &, so, higher mp$. The basic difficulty we face, is the price difference between the 2 grades being, if you're very lucky, 10p a litre & 30p (or more, probably, on the freeway) - say, 46c - $1.37 a gallon.

Yep. Here it’s labeled “May contain up to 10% ethanol” across all octane ratings (no word if that’s by volume or mass) but that’s basically American for “we dump in whatever and average it out”

We also have some stuff called E85…which is so bad you can’t use it in two or four stoke engines.

 

[Johnny O]

Another interesting read.

https://extension.psu.edu/fuel-ethanol-hero-or-villain

BTW Ethanol actually increases octane. It's a tricky issue as indicated in the above article. I have a 4.0 L Ford OHV engine in an old Ranger and it'll hate me for using premium (higher octane) gasoline since it doesn't burn completely in lower compression engines due to its lower volatility and some other design issues with the 4.0L. The result is lower MPGs and enhanced carbon deposits with lots of detonation (pinging) when going back to using the recommended 87 octane gas.

This is less the ethanol and more the surfactants and stabilizers. Methyl Ethyl Ketone being the primary culprit. Unadulterated ethanol is subject to hefty taxes(in the US…I don’t know about other countries) so in industry and the sciences it gets adulterated to make it unsafe to drink, therefore cheaper. Methanol and Isopropanol come in tied for second place., though it’s often a mistake x of the three.

Fuel surfactants and waxes are a whole separate issue.

 

[02blue]

This is less the ethanol and more the surfactants and stabilizers. Methyl Ethyl Ketone being the primary culprit. Unadulterated ethanol is subject to hefty taxes(in the US…I don’t know about other countries) so in industry and the sciences it gets adulterated to make it unsafe to drink, therefore cheaper. Methanol and Isopropanol come in tied for second place., though it’s often a mistake x of the three.

Fuel surfactants and waxes are a whole separate issue.

Yeah this price thing is definitely true! Where I work we can only use 200 proof anhydrous (guess that's redundant) and it cost twice as much per volume as the other forms. In PA it would have an actual Liquor Control Board label/seal on it. In MD we get local stuff so it may not have to go through as many regulatory steps.

We really don't know what form of ethanol is added to gasoline. Really "up to 10% ethanol" doesn't say much. Could be all sorts of other chemicals if they're using some industrial denatured alcohol. MEK has very noticeable odor too and difficult to remove from ethanol. Good deterrent for consumption. It's funny how fuel companies are very proud of their proprietary mixed of detergents but who knows what else is in there. I assume it is much better than the early days of motoring as far as uniformity and at least they got the lead out...

 

[Johnny O]

Yeah this price thing is definitely true! Where I work we can only use 200 proof anhydrous (guess that's redundant) and it cost twice as much per volume as the other forms. In PA it would have an actual Liquor Control Board label/seal on it. In MD we get local stuff so it may not have to go through as many regulatory steps.

We really don't know what form of ethanol is added to gasoline. Really "up to 10% ethanol" doesn't say much. Could be all sorts of other chemicals if they're using some industrial denatured alcohol. MEK has very noticeable odor too and difficult to remove from ethanol. Good deterrent for consumption. It's funny how fuel companies are very proud of their proprietary mixed of detergents but who knows what else is in there. I assume it is much better than the early days of motoring as far as uniformity and at least they got the lead out...

Yep. I purchase 95-98% for the labs and in gallon jugs, then have to triple distill it so it can be used for reagents and equipment.

Cheaper to do that than maintain permits.

Had a student analyze gasoline a few years back. Unironicaly, the etoh content was always above 10% a month after the harvest. It was lowest in January

 

[Deb'nKJ]

We also have some stuff called E85…which is so bad you can’t use it in two or four stoke engines.

I remember that, years ago I ran down R66 in a flexfuel Impala.

Loved the price - but not the amount of fuel wasted trying to find it on sale. Soon gave up on that, so doubt I found 4 gas stations on the entire trip. Surprised it's still available, at all.

(I'm saving all the other material for a long train journey when, hopefully, my ability to concentrate is restored)