Power steering whine?

[Duster]

I parked on a slope, front end up the hill and left it idling at the curb. When I got back in and took off, I had a constant whine. It was dark and I wasn't far from home so I just ran home. The whine didn't seem louder when turning, just changed with engine RPM. I really had no clue where the whine was coming from. And it got quieter as I drove. But once I got home I could still hear a little whine, Searching for the source I could hear a change in sound when I opened the power steering pump reservoir cap. So I assume it is the pump.

I first thought maybe an o-ring and sucking air. But looking down in there I don't see bubbles or foaming in the fluid in the reservoir. Also I don't think it is low on fluid. I can't really find detailed instructions on checking the fluid level though. Can't find anywhere that it says to check when hot or cold, nor rather or not to turn the cap on the threads. When I think of all of this in reverse I kinda really expected it was going to be low or have a leak. But I don't really see anything jumping out at me. I'll have to check it out in daylight.

So I'm looking for opinions on this. I searched and mostly found threads of leaks and even some where the pulley blew off, etc. But not much about anyone describing sounds and symptoms leading up to replacing the pump. So those of you that have been through it, let me know.

On the replacement, just replace the pump and the o-ring on the pressure line?

I haven't even looked at pumps yet. Hoping they come with the reservoir and pulley. If they don't that will suck pulling and pressing a pulley. And there is probably o-rings or seals to deal with on the reservoir. Blah.

 

[seafish]

Also I don't think it is low on fluid. I can't really find detailed instructions on checking the fluid level though. Can't find anywhere that it says to check when hot or cold,

Not sure what year you have, but my 2005 CRD has Hot and Cold with BOTH max and min levels embossed on the PS reservoir... PS pump whining can certainly be an indicator of low fluid so you'd best check again. The fact that the whine started when the truck was on a incline adds credence to that theory

If the fluid is dark or the rez is dirty and hard to see the level, then simply point a flashlight into to the rez after removing the cap.

On EDIT: some reservoirs were black, but the levels should still be embossed on the side, just harder to see them.

I recently posted a quick and easy way to completely flush out all of fluid the PS pump and lines, although it does involve removing the air filter box for access.

What did you do to your jeep today?

Getting closer and closer to Giddyup being back together -- Radiator and intercooler went back in and also plumbed up with new hoses. Put a little smear of silicone grease on the hose bibs to keep them from totally sticking next time I need to pull them.

www.jeepkj.com

 

[Johnny O]

What color is the fluid?

Not sure what year you have, but my 2005 CRD has Hot and Cold with BOTH max and min levels embossed on the PS reservoir... PS pump whining can certainly be an indicator of low fluid so you'd best check again. The fact that the whine started when the truck was on a incline adds credence to that theory

If the fluid is dark or the rez is dirty and hard to see the level, then simply point a flashlight into to the rez after removing the cap.

On EDIT: some reservoirs were black, but the levels should still be embossed on the side, just harder to see them.

I recently posted a quick and easy way to completely flush out all of fluid the PS pump and lines, although it does involve removing the air filter box for access.

What did you do to your jeep today?

Getting closer and closer to Giddyup being back together -- Radiator and intercooler went back in and also plumbed up with new hoses. Put a little smear of silicone grease on the hose bibs to keep them from totally sticking next time I need to pull them.

www.jeepkj.com

I can confirm this is a good method. I did something similar on Bert, though I used a drill pump and and quite a few bottles of juice to flush the system out.

 

[u2slow]

I have found the p/s system fairly rugged despite some leaks. Keep the fluid topped up. The rack has leaked, and then stopped. Hose has leaked, replaced, leaks again.

Have had used replacement parts on standy for about 5 years and not needed them.

 

[seafish]

Y

Keep the fluid topped up.

Ya... thats definitely important in a closed pressure system thats leaking.
I guess one could even think of the PS pump whine as a factory installed warning alert that the fluid is getting low??

 

[u2slow]

Ya... thats definitely important in a closed pressure system thats leaking.

I dont know if I've even put a pint in the whole 12 years owning it. The hoses get visibly wet. P/S oil spray in the passenger wheel well a few different times. Doesnt seem to leak right now.

 

[Duster]

It's a 2007 gas. Reservoir is black and it has the dipstick attached to the cap. It doesn't seem low. The fluid color is what I would describe as a pink that has browned some?

I also have had someone else suggest I just change the fluid and see. I really expected low since it started on a hill. But doesn't seem to be and I think maybe it is temperature related instead. Doesn't seem to be whining on cold startup. It's been raining so I haven't done much or taken it for a drive.

Also had a friend suggest I take the belt off and check the pulley for play etc. It feels fine turning. There is no wobble play. But there is a little bit of straight in/out play?

Leaning towards sucking the fluid out of the reservoir, refilling and turning the steering, and repeating these steps several times to change most of the fluid.

Anyone know what the system capacity is?

Also looks like many of the pumps don't come with a pulley or a reservoir. Some have one but not the other. Anyone know what is involved in transferring the reservoir to a new pump? I think a friend of mine has the tool to press the pulley off and back on.

 

[Duster]

I pulled some of the fluid up out of an ATF+4 bottle with a syringe for a baseline. Then pulled some up out of the reservior. It looked not so bad in the tubing part of it and worse in the body of the syringe. More you are looking through the darker it is I guess. Looked more brown. VS brand new it was dark enough I was like yeah gonna change that and see.

So I did and I really can't tell anything yet because it has not actually been loud since it first sat overnight before doing anything. And my ear is in tune listing for the whine/moan so I can still detect it some. It's faint so it may be how it normally sounded. You know how it is.

I didn't want to remove lines and pump it out because I didn't have a helper. So I just pulled out what was in the rez, refilled, drove around the neighborhood and repeated. My syringe was small so I only had time to repeat that 4 times before it got dark. So I took out 8 oz +/- at a time and added 8 oz +/- back. I used a quart total. I don't know what the total capacity of the system is and this is not the ideal method either. Not like an oil change where you drop all the dirty oil at once and add clean. I think it would take at least 2 quarts doing it this way to get the majority of the oil out and get it looking new fresh and clean, due to the 8 oz of new fluid mixing with the rest of the systems old fluid and so on.

Here's a pic after. Up top is new fluid. The darker is the before and the smiley face is how it looks after4 rez change sessions to mix in a quart of new fluid.

 

[ltd02]

How long have you owned this 07? Way back when I had my 02, I had a terrible whine when it got below about 40F. The 02s actually came with power steering fluid from the factory. Apparently the PO added at some point, but used ATF+4. They don't mix well. I flushed the system many times but could never get rid of the whine. Never hurt anything, just annoying.

 

[Duster]

I've owned it since 6600 miles. Unfortunately I really can't confirm for sure nothing has ever been mixed. This is because I let the lack of a transmission dipstick and drain plug discourage me from doing the transmission maintenance myself. So I had been taking it in to the dealer periodically to have that done along with other service items. I didn't realize how badly they treated/paid their techs and didn't realize this was a huge mistake until I had another issue and discovered mixed fluids post-service.

That said though, I think it would have made noise before now. But can't be sure.

I'll work it a couple of hours and see what happens I guess. If OK then I will probably put another quart through it and see how it goes. If not hopefully I can limp home and replace the pump with no complaints.

 

[Jeremy-WI]

Check the tensioner pulleys. If they haven't been changed on a 2007, they may need it. I had one go out a month or so ago with 190k miles. I would have guessed the noise I heard came from the alternator or power steering when I was driving

 

[Trainmaster]

I've changed three of these. The hoses leak at the connections and the pumps sometimes go bad. I buy a rebuilt pump with reservoir and pulley. My 05's pulley would never come off in one piece. Don't even try. Spend the extra eight bucks.

In 05 at least , there were two types of return hose. Make sure you buy the correct one. One is just a straight hose with spring clamps and the other has fittings. Watch videos. There's a way to drill a hole behind the headlight housing to access a bolt that holds the hose bracket.

Hate to bare bad news, but usually if the whine doesn't work its way out or go away when changing some fluid, the pump has earned its retirement.

 

[Him73067]

I had an 02 and went through 3 pumps and 3 flushes trying to get rid of the squeal only to find out that my steering rack was the problem. Once I changed it the noise was gone for good. Never would have thought the rack would cause it.

 

[Duster]

I think I am going to try sucking out the reservoir and refilling, driving and repeating a few more times until I finish off this quart of fluid. I can barely hear it now at a stoplight. It kinda moans faintly once the engine RPM drops under 850, and moans more pronounced with additional RPM when you first go to take off until it gets from idle up past 850 again.

There's zero change in sound or pitch turning the wheels or anything like that. To me it seems more like when I have encountered air or a disturbance or a restriction in a pressure system. But I don't see any bubbles in the reservoir. The only thing I can find is the pressure line has almost slipped off the cooler. Looks like I need to remove the weird clamp, push the line back to seat and install a regular hose clamp or 2 if there's room. Wondering how that oem clamp would come off besides cutting it off???

Kind of wondering if the line almost blew off then the noise started and if the fluid might be cavitating before reaching the cooler there the way the line is slipped back and cocked now.

 

[seafish]

If that line is actually leaking then even a small amount of air in the system might be causing the whine that you are hearing. You might try seeing if there is enough slack in the line length to cut off the end behind the ear clamp and then reconnect the fresh end to the cooler and secure it with another hose clamp.

 

[Jeremy-WI]

I think I am going to try sucking out the reservoir and refilling, driving and repeating a few more times until I finish off this quart of fluid. I can barely hear it now at a stoplight. It kinda moans faintly once the engine RPM drops under 850, and moans more pronounced with additional RPM when you first go to take off until it gets from idle up past 850 again.

There's zero change in sound or pitch turning the wheels or anything like that. To me it seems more like when I have encountered air or a disturbance or a restriction in a pressure system. But I don't see any bubbles in the reservoir. The only thing I can find is the pressure line has almost slipped off the cooler. Looks like I need to remove the weird clamp, push the line back to seat and install a regular hose clamp or 2 if there's room. Wondering how that oem clamp would come off besides cutting it off???

Kind of wondering if the line almost blew off then the noise started and if the fluid might be cavitating before reaching the cooler there the way the line is slipped back and cocked now.

Does it actually have a power steering cooler?

 

[seafish]

Does it actually have a power steering cooler?

seems like it does --

You must be registered for see images attach

 

[Jeremy-WI]

Rockauto.com shows one available for my 2006 but I looked and my Liberty doesn't have the cooler.
I have seen plenty of posts showing people using a dremel disk to cut the crimp off the transmission cooler line to replace with a hose clamp

 

[seafish]

Rockauto.com shows one available for my 2006 but I looked and my Liberty doesn't have the cooler.
I have seen plenty of posts showing people using a dremel disk to cut the crimp off the transmission cooler line to replace with a hose clamp

I am confused now...so you are posting a pic of your AT cooler line and thinking that it is causing a PS whine??

 

[Duster]

My 2007 has both a trans cooler and a power steering cooler. That rubber flap by the hoses is the rubber flap to the side of the headlight which I guess is there to direct air through all the cooling items.

Yes I have done the same job with the stupid trans line running to the cooler from the 42 RLE VLP (variable line pressure). I had some weird crap go on with my transmission a year or two ago and knew to look there, expecting it to be blown apart and my trans fluid on the ground... because a friend of mine had this happen on his Nitro. What a pain of a job that is to cut through that stupid hydraulic crimp. Especially if it's like mine was and you have to cut both crimps. Can't get at the trans line side crimp hardly. I cut both off and replaced the rubber hydraulic hose and put regular hose clamps. No more issues.

Looks like all I can do is cut this clamp off? I think that is what I am going to do as soon as I get a chance, push the hose back in place where it's seated normal. Then install a regular hose clamp. Here is a pic of the clamp on the upper connection. The hose is to the stop like it is supposed to be and you can kinda see the strange clamp. I am guessing this was done this way to sell the return line and cooler line as an assembly with the cooler.